Additionally changing at a federal level from First Past The Post to some kind of proportional voting system. FPTP strongly incentivises devolving to only two viable parties and then encourages them to put as much distance between each other as possible resulting in each being pushed towards extreme positions. This is a double wamy and we’re seeing the results of that now.
A proportional voting system on the other hand allows for, and in fact encourages multiple smaller parties. Depending on the variant chosen it can also reward moderate policies that appeal to the largest base while also not being disliked by as few people as possible. STAR would be an excellent choice for this outcome.
Using proportional voting would lead to a more diverse Congress and Senate forcing representatives to actually engage in cooperation and compromise rather than just brute forcing through a majority every time they happen to achieve it.
I agree with you, but it is worth noting that most election laws are done at the state and not the national level. If US Congress required states to use RCV, you would have a weird mismatch where national politicians and state politicians were elected with a different system. The US federal government only has the legal authority to change election laws for national politicians not state politicians.
I imagine that would cause some confusion when your state politician is elected by FPTP and your national politician is elected by RCV.
Represent.us is an non-partisan organization working to help push RCV on a local and state level. I just found it from lemmy earlier today.
I think this is one of those cases where the federal government needs to step in and mandate all federal positions use a proportional voting system. If states want to elect their non-federal offices using some other system that’s fine, it’s their right to do so, but at the federal level it’s important that everyone be on a level playing field.
I know the presidents election process is somewhat specified in the constitution so that would need to be amended, but I don’t think the house or senate have anything specified other than the number of representatives each state gets. So ultimately we’d need a new amendment that changes the existing amendment specifying how the president gets elected as well as adding new rules for how representatives are elected.
I mean sure, it would be great if they did but have you seen our federal government lately. It’s all they can do to keep the government funded.
It wouldn’t require an amendment to do at a federal level, all congress would have to do is pass a law requiring that states that decide to choose their electors via popular vote do so by RCV or STAR. However, if they did that it red states could theoretically pass a law saying that state representatives get to choose the electors instead of the people.
I think the easiest way to actually change the system (instead of simply hoping for change from a federal level) is to push for the change locally. That means push for your city or your state to adopt RCV. Represent us has 10+ campaigns going on in various states that are pushing for various types of voter reform.
My current shithole of a state has literally passed a law that bans anyone from using RCV state wide. As with the standard playbook they’ve also gerrymandered everything to maximize the voting power of those deep red areas. Pretty much the only way we’re getting RCV at this point is either the complete destruction of the GOP, or federal mandate.
I can believe it. Very few politicians (and probably no GOP politicans) are fans of RCV and other systemic democracy reforms. But don’t ignore the fact that the most successful way to changing the state laws is through ballot initiatives. It is the best tool we, as citizens, have. Marijuana, minimum wage increases, and abortion access have all been won through ballot initiatives. Every state has some form of ballot initiative that can be used although some are more restrictive than others.
Pretty much the only way we’re getting RCV at this point is either the complete destruction of the GOP, or federal mandate.
I can certainly understand this viewpoint, but to me it seems somewhat like defeatism. I have very little hope that our politicians will willingly take federal action on issues like RCV and campaign finance. The opinions of 90% Americans have very little impact on if Congress will make laws about that particular issue.
Money does. They serve their donors not the American people. And their donors largely want status quo.
Local and Direct Action on the other hand works and is achievable. Women’s suffrage, interracial marriage, and marriage equality all started with local grassroots movements before they were enshrined into law nationwide. More recently it’s been marijuana which started with a few states legalizing it and is now widespread even in red areas. It wouldn’t surprise me if it is federally de-scheduled soon. That was all made possible by it first being legalized in colorado and then in many many other states.
I think local action in other states can certainly pave the way, but I don’t think local action in my state will make any headway at all until we’re already at the point where people are seriously discussing federal mandates. They’re just too dug in and entrenched.
The other option would be if the GOP imploded to the point where a concerted push by non-GOP voters could overcome the gerrymandering and voter suppression tactics in order to get a Democrat elected as governor and hopefully a majority of the state senate as well. At that point local pressure might be enough to get the RCV ban repealed and with even further pressure RCV or STAR voting enacted. I think that’s less likely to occur than a federal mandate though.
Ultimately though, no matter the exact mechanism of achieving it every state is going to need to enact proportional voting if it’s going to have any hope of fixing our politics, and for that I still think we’ll need a federal mandate, whether the majority of states have adopted it at that point or not.
Of course, I don’t deny that federal action is needed. I just think that historically local action builds momentum towards federal action. One federal action that is needed is a repeal of the outlaw of multi-member house districts. There is a 1967 federal law that requires single member districts. It was supposedly passed because of the fear that southern states might resort to winner-take-all at-large elections to dilute the voting strength of newly-enfranchised blacks in the South.
Even if RCV may not be feasible right now that doesn’t mean that there isn’t something that could be pushed for instead like a independent redistricting committee to fight gerrymandering or a minimum wage increase. Enough GOP voters will vote for good ballot measures to make them pass simply because there is no D or R attached. You only need to look at pro abortion access ballot initiatives to see that. Even Ohio amended their constitution to protect abortion access via ballot initiative.
Additionally changing at a federal level from First Past The Post to some kind of proportional voting system. FPTP strongly incentivises devolving to only two viable parties and then encourages them to put as much distance between each other as possible resulting in each being pushed towards extreme positions. This is a double wamy and we’re seeing the results of that now.
A proportional voting system on the other hand allows for, and in fact encourages multiple smaller parties. Depending on the variant chosen it can also reward moderate policies that appeal to the largest base while also not being disliked by as few people as possible. STAR would be an excellent choice for this outcome.
Using proportional voting would lead to a more diverse Congress and Senate forcing representatives to actually engage in cooperation and compromise rather than just brute forcing through a majority every time they happen to achieve it.
I agree with you, but it is worth noting that most election laws are done at the state and not the national level. If US Congress required states to use RCV, you would have a weird mismatch where national politicians and state politicians were elected with a different system. The US federal government only has the legal authority to change election laws for national politicians not state politicians.
I imagine that would cause some confusion when your state politician is elected by FPTP and your national politician is elected by RCV.
Represent.us is an non-partisan organization working to help push RCV on a local and state level. I just found it from lemmy earlier today.
I think this is one of those cases where the federal government needs to step in and mandate all federal positions use a proportional voting system. If states want to elect their non-federal offices using some other system that’s fine, it’s their right to do so, but at the federal level it’s important that everyone be on a level playing field.
I know the presidents election process is somewhat specified in the constitution so that would need to be amended, but I don’t think the house or senate have anything specified other than the number of representatives each state gets. So ultimately we’d need a new amendment that changes the existing amendment specifying how the president gets elected as well as adding new rules for how representatives are elected.
I mean sure, it would be great if they did but have you seen our federal government lately. It’s all they can do to keep the government funded.
It wouldn’t require an amendment to do at a federal level, all congress would have to do is pass a law requiring that states that decide to choose their electors via popular vote do so by RCV or STAR. However, if they did that it red states could theoretically pass a law saying that state representatives get to choose the electors instead of the people.
I think the easiest way to actually change the system (instead of simply hoping for change from a federal level) is to push for the change locally. That means push for your city or your state to adopt RCV. Represent us has 10+ campaigns going on in various states that are pushing for various types of voter reform.
My current shithole of a state has literally passed a law that bans anyone from using RCV state wide. As with the standard playbook they’ve also gerrymandered everything to maximize the voting power of those deep red areas. Pretty much the only way we’re getting RCV at this point is either the complete destruction of the GOP, or federal mandate.
I can believe it. Very few politicians (and probably no GOP politicans) are fans of RCV and other systemic democracy reforms. But don’t ignore the fact that the most successful way to changing the state laws is through ballot initiatives. It is the best tool we, as citizens, have. Marijuana, minimum wage increases, and abortion access have all been won through ballot initiatives. Every state has some form of ballot initiative that can be used although some are more restrictive than others.
I can certainly understand this viewpoint, but to me it seems somewhat like defeatism. I have very little hope that our politicians will willingly take federal action on issues like RCV and campaign finance. The opinions of 90% Americans have very little impact on if Congress will make laws about that particular issue.
Money does. They serve their donors not the American people. And their donors largely want status quo.
Local and Direct Action on the other hand works and is achievable. Women’s suffrage, interracial marriage, and marriage equality all started with local grassroots movements before they were enshrined into law nationwide. More recently it’s been marijuana which started with a few states legalizing it and is now widespread even in red areas. It wouldn’t surprise me if it is federally de-scheduled soon. That was all made possible by it first being legalized in colorado and then in many many other states.
I think local action in other states can certainly pave the way, but I don’t think local action in my state will make any headway at all until we’re already at the point where people are seriously discussing federal mandates. They’re just too dug in and entrenched.
The other option would be if the GOP imploded to the point where a concerted push by non-GOP voters could overcome the gerrymandering and voter suppression tactics in order to get a Democrat elected as governor and hopefully a majority of the state senate as well. At that point local pressure might be enough to get the RCV ban repealed and with even further pressure RCV or STAR voting enacted. I think that’s less likely to occur than a federal mandate though.
Ultimately though, no matter the exact mechanism of achieving it every state is going to need to enact proportional voting if it’s going to have any hope of fixing our politics, and for that I still think we’ll need a federal mandate, whether the majority of states have adopted it at that point or not.
Of course, I don’t deny that federal action is needed. I just think that historically local action builds momentum towards federal action. One federal action that is needed is a repeal of the outlaw of multi-member house districts. There is a 1967 federal law that requires single member districts. It was supposedly passed because of the fear that southern states might resort to winner-take-all at-large elections to dilute the voting strength of newly-enfranchised blacks in the South.
Even if RCV may not be feasible right now that doesn’t mean that there isn’t something that could be pushed for instead like a independent redistricting committee to fight gerrymandering or a minimum wage increase. Enough GOP voters will vote for good ballot measures to make them pass simply because there is no D or R attached. You only need to look at pro abortion access ballot initiatives to see that. Even Ohio amended their constitution to protect abortion access via ballot initiative.