Pure poetry from AndyJHawk:
Like the Honda e before it, it’s a vehicle too tiny for America’s truck-shaped digestive system.
Thanks to badly written software, you can literally design “planned obsolescence” into your products.
“The computer says you need to replace your 15,000 dollar battery pack.”
“But my car is only six months old!”
“Yeah, but the Computer SAYS-”
Software that is completely unnecessary. There is zero reason a battery powered vehicle needs to be much different software wise than an ICE. They do not need 20" touchscreens packed with a custom infotainment system written by hardware focused developers.
The Megane E-tech has functionality in its satnav that lets you plot a route with charging stations on the way, showing how much capacity you will have left when you get to them. Not essential, but very useful for somebody who is new to EVs.
Software that communicates with power companies to allow the car to charge overnight at advantageous rates, or even feed energy back into the grid. Again, not essential, but good for the customer and helps with the transition to green electricity.
I have that in my ICE car and I never use it (map of gas stations correlated with remaining fuel). That’s not specific to an EV.
Any of those features can be in a smartphone attached to your dashboard. Sure you have some benefits in accessing the car data, but they are small.
Your ICE has a significantly longer range, and the road network has evolved so that you can be reasonably confident that you’ll find a filling station when you need one.
Today I’m driving an EV that doesn’t have it, and I’m missing it. Different EVs have different ranges and not every filling station on the autobahn has chargers. On the other hand, there are lots of places just off the autobahn which do have chargers. It’s a different game. Your mileage may vary of course.
Electric cars need software to smooth out motor output to create an enjoyable driving experience. They also need to manage battery health and regenerative braking.
Edit: cars like the Ioniq N seem to be the exception while most cars have problems like the Mercedes EQS that people report has unpredictable braking which means you can’t learn how to control it.
battery controllers and motor controllers are available as cheap, simple, stable, off-the-shelf dedicated hardware and there’s no reason budget evs would need to do any coding for them, maybe just some variable adjustment. those things are not controlled by the user facing software being talked about here.
Maybe it’s like you say if you’re making a shit box but you can’t make a driver’s car without careful consideration. This conversation would be better to have with car enthusiasts rather than technology enthusiasts.
shit box or luxury car, this article is not talking about motor controller or battery controller software.
And since when have you known any computer to be problem-free?
Software that’s not made from overworked engineers working 80 hours a week pressured to work even faster to complete this week’s sprint.
I’m so tired of “computers are buggy and everyone accepts that”. No! Computers don’t have to be buggy, you just have to not shove trash software on it made by morons doing the bare minimum.
I have software that’s been running on servers for literal years, not a single bug. The hardware’s been sized appropriately and I wrote good, sustainable and maintainable code. My computers all can easily do weeks and months of uptime. I pick up my laptop and open the lid and 100% of the time it wakes up from sleep and it’s ready to go.
The overwhelming majority of “production” and “enterprise quality” code I work with is total garbage that should never have been written and its author never hired in the tech space. We repeatedly get reports on how X car manufacturer was pwned for not following best practices that are a decade or two old.
Corporate greed makes EVs suck because it’s developed for as cheap as possible and the target is “good enough customers tolerate it”. Shit barely works properly when going through the happy path and the error path just… usually crashes your car.
I’ve had to reboot my car at red lights way too fucking often and it’s not even an EV. 2020 model and the infotainment reliably crashes if I have a Slack or Zoom call going because it tries to read the phone number off my phone over Bluetooth and doesn’t know how to handle a null phone number = the radio crashes.
It’s not fucking rocket science.
Seriously.
Yes, there’s an element of complexity that makes it hard to completely avoid bugs. But there’s way more arbitrary complexity that doesn’t serve a purpose and unnecessary dependencies that create more problems than they solve causing issues than there is just the inherent difficulty of what software actually needs to do.
Also, maybe just don’t copy paste code from 20 different tracking tools wherever they tell you to.
Edit: also cloud everything. The amount of overhead it takes to put 100 million users in the cloud when there’s nothing they need that can’t be done locally is stupid as hell.
The headline is very misleading.
This is NOT just about build quality of EVs or engine problems or problems inherent with EVs, it includes minor annoyances that aren’t quality problems. Also, this is from reported problems on a SURVEY, not actual problems taken to a dealer to fix. Dodge has the worst rating here while Ram has the best, because Ram owners don’t report problems on surveys and not because Ram has better quality (though it likely does as well).
And most of the issues are with tech that is included in higher end cars (rear collision avoidance, rear seat safety belt alarms, lane keeping assist, automatic braking assist, etc), and almost all EVs in the US are higher end cars that are chock full of these up-sells. People are also complaining about entertainment system software and phone pairing, which isn’t different from EV to ICE.
Finally, Tesla is one of the worst on the list while also making up the majority of EVs. So the company that has notoriously bad quality and bad design choices strongly skews the metric, since they ONLY make EVs. If Tesla made an ICE it would be just as bad.
Volkswagen just paid Rivian a truckload of money because VW couldn’t figure out how to write EV controller software. It’s ridiculous.
don’t make them into smartphones. problem solved, you are welcome auto industry.
I just want an EV company to make the equivalent of a shitty Toyota Prius.
A Nissan Leaf?
Chevy Bolt EV/EUV
General Motors accidentally made a good car so that’s why they had to kill it.
I was pleasantly surprised how good the Bolt was and still liked it after 3 years of leasing it. I was ready to get another one after the lease was over, but the pandemic changed my decision (working from home meant I didn’t really need a nice car and definitely wasn’t driving enough for the price plus-up for EV to make sense, so I got a used beater).
How did you feel about the L3 charging rate? 50kW isn’t super fast.
Barely noticed it. The only time most people would use that are on long road trips, which I only take about twice a year (most of my road trips are between 100-200 miles one way, which can be done with filling up at the destination). So if I used L3, it was for 30 minutes while grabbing lunch on the road and getting half the charge “filled.” 99% of my charging was L2 at home or at destinations.
I own a Mach e. Seeing Ford that high is terrifying to think how bad it can get because as high as Ford is on that list, it sucks pretty bad.
Turns out making drivable iPhones is a shitty idea compared to the highly simplified electric motorcycles that work well? Huh. Who’da thunk?
The good news is programming everywhere is garbage.
A friend bought a new BMW, with all the bells and whistles. The app for the car is like a game, where you have to subscribe to get the juicy content.
You can subscribe to different feature-packs. They sure made the effort, that the $$$ system works flawlessly.
Like, the app surely is buggy and things may not work as expected, but you only get to try it out, when your money is on their account anyway.
This isn’t software that is exclusive to EVs.
Nissan leafs and toyota Prius have been around in big numbers for more than a decade.
It’s the enshitiffication that all modern cars are doing: cramming way too much tech into something that is for moving people around, not entertaining them
Look into used Bolt EVs, many are in the 12-14k range after tax credit, 230 miles on a charge, no bells and whistles, drives great. Many have new batteries after the recall that happened a few years ago.
How many clues have been spilled here to show s/he is american?
The article specifies a JD Power study, which is an American institution. Seems obvious enough…
I think a big part of the issue is that the Chinese market is fucking huge, and the Chinese market also seems to love gimmicky software crap in their cars, and often emphasizes that over hardware features and other general aspects of, you know, being a car. It’s an unfortunate and obnoxious case of carmakers following the money.
